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Golden Breeder Allen Bain?

Home Forums General Golden Breeder Allen Bain?

This topic contains 80 replies, has 39 voices, and was last updated by  E.Ramsey 1 month ago.

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  • #9434

    Aurorelle
    Participant

    Hello everyone!

    I’m new to owning a dog so I want to make sure I’m doing it right (I have cats but their much less high maintenance). I called many breeders and I settled with one named Allen or Al Bain in Campbellford, ON. He seemed to know his stuff and claims to have over 60 years of experience. He gave me an 8 year guarantee on hip and heart problems, and claims to train support and seeing eye dogs. I couldn’t find much about him online, except for a thread on this forum from 4 years ago, so I thought I’d try asking again. Anyway, has anyone heard of Al Bain or have any experience with him?

    Thanks a lot!

  • #60443

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    What is his kennel name??

    Personally I would do some research and digging – I know not everyone is computer savy but if he is a good breeder his kennel name should come up in show or trial results, etc. I also am not comfortable with someone with a 8 year guarantee…sounds super wonderful but 90% of hereditary problems show up in the first years of a dogs life (other than 1 eye problem that I know of)

  • #60444

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    Hmmm- did a google search…I would strongly suggest he is a backyard type breeder, not CKC registered – but that might not matter to you. A year ago, he only offered 6 year guarantees LOL.

    You will definitely want to visit the dogs, his home, see the contract, etc.

  • #60470

    Aurorelle
    Participant

    Well, if most problems show up in the first few years doesn’t that make the guarantee more effective? I would be more worried if they showed up after 8 years..

  • #60436

    Mom2Maddie
    Participant

    Personally I’d keep looking. There are lots of reputable breeders in Ontario that do the necessary clearances (hip, eye, heart, elbow) before a breeding takes place and that would be the bare minimum for me to start considering a breeder.

    Like Cheslyn said visit any breeder you are thinking of if at all possible, meet their dogs, see everything first hand.

  • #60465

    Vanessa
    Participant

    I think if I was going to get an expensive Pure-Bred, I would want to see some evidence of the breeder going to shows etc. I know a lady who breeds Bouviers and the shows consume huge amounts of her time (especially when she generally only does one – two litters per year total from her kennel). My dog came from a couple who just had to retrievers and a litter a year. No papers on the pup or the parents but that didn’t matter to me, and it was reflected in the price.

  • #60457

    Meadow
    Participant

    Vanessa has a good point. There is nothing wrong with a back yard breeder per se. The 8 year guarantee really would mean nothing to me. I mean honestly… is the guarantee that if there is a genetic problem, you can return your dog for a refund of the purchase price? If so – who would do that? I just got a puppy 9 days ago, and already the 1-year guarantee means nothing to me. I wouldn’t give Haven back to the breeder for a refund!! I love this pup SO MUCH!

    If you want to go with the fella you found, but he doesn’t show the sire or dam (which means they don’t have to have all their health and temperament clearances), then as long as he isn’t charging more than about $500-$700 for an unproven, unregistered litter, I would think that was fairly okay. As long as you are aware that the cheaper price comes with a risk. I just took the same risk for the pup I got. As a mixed breed, she is not CKC registered, and as she was in a foster home, I never even met the sire or dam. That is supposed to be a red flag, but I met the foster Mom, saw the conditions (excellent!), and made my decision. I am willing to accept what may come of this, and I am fully happy with my decision.

    I haven’t been to your breeder’s site, but if he is charging better than $800 as a BYB, I would be suspicious. Just be careful. Visit the breeder. Ask to see vet records on parents, grandparents, etc. If he’s been doing this for 60 years, he would have good history, I would think. πŸ™‚

    ~Maureen

  • #60463

    scot girl
    Participant

    @vanessa 59890 wrote:

    I think if I was going to get an expensive Pure-Bred, I would want to see some evidence of the breeder going to shows etc. I know a lady who breeds Bouviers and the shows consume huge amounts of her time (especially when she generally only does one – two litters per year total from her kennel). My dog came from a couple who just had to retrievers and a litter a year. No papers on the pup or the parents but that didn’t matter to me, and it was reflected in the price.

    We bought Zeus from a family who has two retrievers and decided to have a litter, no papers and only a 30 day guarantee, had first shots and was wormed.. We did see the parents and were both healthy, fit looking dogs, so we decided to buy Zeus and it was a fair price but we immediately took him to the vet to be checked out. Lots of people say you get what you pay for but with dogs it is a gamble as you never know what kind of health problems will arise. I had a Sheltie several years ago, a purebred with all his papers and that dog grew taller than he should have, his ears were not correct and he had a life long allergy problem which cost me a fortune but I would not have changed him. One thing I would suggest is that if you decide to go with a breeder you should turn up unexpectedly so you can see what the place is really like, this is also a good idea when checking out boarding facilities cos if the place is kept clean they should not have a problem. AURORELLE, where do you live? Maybe someone on here lives close to you and could recomend a breeder. Good Luck in your Search :dog:

  • #60462

    Pat
    Participant

    I total agree with most of the comments, depends alot what you want in a dog- show, registered to where to get the pup. Carmel came from a back yard breeder, they had both parents, whom hubby got to met, (Carmel was an early christmas prsent for me, hubby and daughter picked her out). Everything was clean, the dogs looked healthy, and were Vet checked, dewormed and had first shots. Carmel was said to have a heart mumor, which disappeared within the frist year. We only paid $200 for her. But turned out she has a very rare skin disease that causes her skin to flake consistantly. She takes almost $40 in supplements a month as well as antihistmines (included in that amount). Needs weekly bathing with two different shampoos and a cream rinse to keep down the flakes which can be worse than the shedding hair. And is very prone to hot spots and needs constant checking to make sure she doesn’t develope any really bad ones. Would I return her to the breeder? Never! She is part of the family. I was looking at the past years vet bills (Carmel had a lump removed-wasn’t cancer and Cheyanne was treated for Lyme disease) I spend around $2500 on the two of them. Do I reget the money I spent-No. They are famliy and I would not return them ever. A quantee would have ment nothing to us when the skin condition was dignosed.
    Keep checking around and go visit places, this Al Bain might be Okay, but maybe check out some other breeders as well. My Hubby did check other breeders but nobody had the any pups that would be ready that christmas.

  • #60445

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    Sorry I did not meant to come across as registered dog or nothing. I just do not like anyone that boasts about claims…they better be able to prove them clearly to me!

    I know there are several golden rescue groups in Ontario – that could be a good route too!

  • #60440

    Sue
    Participant

    After a little research I found this:
    http://www.hoobly.com/0/0/1436692.html
    Golden Retriever Puppies

    Campbellford, Ontario

    Pets & Animals: Dogs & Puppies: Golden Retriever

    Ad 1436692 placed 1 year ago by allenbain (member since Feb 12, 2008)
    report ad
    Please Sign In or Register to contact member Your Email:
    Message:

    This ad is: ok | empty | a scam | conversational | offensive | overposted

    PY4CTVT6BWTZ.jpg W8DDGG6E8RLJOHAZ3R.jpg
    Six year guarantee
    vet checked , first shots, dewormed
    service dog provider
    parents and grandparent on site
    breeder since 1965
    call Al 705-632-1187
    Golden Retriever Puppies

    Campbellford, Ontario

    Pets & Animals: Dogs & Puppies: Golden Retriever

    Ad 778938 placed 3 years ago by allenbain (member since Feb 12, 2008)
    report ad
    Please Sign In or Register to contact member Your Email:
    Message:

    This ad is: ok | empty | a scam | conversational | offensive | overposted

    First shots , vet checked , dewormed .
    Parents on site , grandparents also .
    Five year guarantee

    please call Al (705)-632-1187
    Wonderful temperment

    I would avoid at all costs. There are so many excellent breeders out there in Ontario that I wouldn’t give this guy a second look. No excellent golden breeder will give you a 6 or 8 year guarantee for one of their dogs and at $430.00 and advertise on something like this site. That’s enough red flags to make me run the other way. Do your research and lots of it and talk to breeders and see what their dogs have to offer to the betterment of the breed. All dogs parents/grandparents etc should have heart, eye, elbow, and hip certs and the parents should have current ones. Even if you don’t want a show quality puppy excellent breeders breed for quality pets. You will pay more upfront but you know what you are getting and hopefully you can avoid all the issues that goldens are prone to. Excellent breeders breed stock to enhance the dogs, BYB’s do not as do unethical breeders.

  • #60446

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    Yeah, I had found those…a bit too much breeding for me. Also, if his dogs are excellant and breed for service dogs, etc he would have a long wait list and never have any left. Could be reasons but questions would have to be asked.

    Tammy

  • #60447

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    Oh Sue – in all fairness he may have advertised on a better site but this one ‘copied’ it. I have advertized a car for sale and had people calling saying they say it on ABC website – which I never heard of before. There are job posting sites like that too πŸ™

  • #60441

    Sue
    Participant

    Way to many red flags Tammy way too many. Not to insult anyone who did not purchase from an excellent golden breeder but when you buy from BYB’s you are just encouraging them to breed more. You are far better off to purchase from a rescue if you cannot afford to pay the higher price. Tammy he’s selling the dogs for $450.00…even if that was 2 or 3 years ago and one add say’s 5 year guarantee and one say’s 6 and the original poster said 8. Does that not raise a red flag or two? I can go onto any kijiji site or anysite like that and see a dime a dozen BYB’s selling for that price, higher or less. And if you are an excellent golden breeder or breeder of any other breed why would you sell on those sites or for that price? Ask a good breeder and they would never.

  • #60466

    kobkob1
    Participant

    Good afternoon, while on the topic of Breeders, has anyone here gotten their golden from Skylon Kennels in Cambridge, Ontario? We have started to think about getting another pup and that is one of the breeders that has interested me. We are just in preliminary stages of planning this addition to our home. Since we lost Barclay in December there is such a void in our life. Thanks for any information you have! (also another place ..Willowcrest Goldens in Orangeville?)

  • #60456

    goldengirl
    Participant

    Hi kobkob1, yes I got my golden from Skylon Kennels. Murphy will be 6 yrs in April, has a wonderful temperament and is a lovely smart dog, we adore her. However, having said that I don’t think I would buy from that kennel again or suggest that anyone else buy from them. She breeds numerous dogs and has many puppies at the same time, more of a puppy factory. Murphy had worms and giardia when I brought her home as a 6 week old pup. She also had allergies which took me a long time to figure out, she’s allergic to chicken and gets terrible skin rashes if she eats it. I called the owner of Skyon when Murphy had skin rashes and she was no help at all saying none of her dogs had anything like that before. With all that said, I wouldn’t recommend the kennel.

  • #60458

    Meadow
    Participant

    @kobkob1 59902 wrote:

    Good afternoon, while on the topic of Breeders, has anyone here gotten their golden from Skylon Kennels in Cambridge, Ontario? We have started to think about getting another pup and that is one of the breeders that has interested me. We are just in preliminary stages of planning this addition to our home. Since we lost Barclay in December there is such a void in our life. Thanks for any information you have! (also another place ..Willowcrest Goldens in Orangeville?)

    Have you checked out Ashmar Goldens, kobkob? Margaret is in Mississauga, and she breeds her English Goldens (she has the females) with the English Golden males at Blackpool Kennels. My Faith is from her, and she is very intelligent and if I say so myself, very beautiful too. πŸ˜‰

    Another EXCELLENT breeder I would recommend is Elaine at Treeverwood Golden. I wanted a puppy from her SO badly, but the timing wasn’t right for us. She whelps her Goldens in her living room, and socializes them amazingly. She often breeds her golden-colored females with either golden-colored males or English Golden males. Her pups are SOOO gorgeous!

    ~Maureen

  • #60432

    3Goldens
    Participant

    @sue 59901 wrote:

    Way to many red flags Tammy way too many. Not to insult anyone who did not purchase from an excellent golden breeder but when you buy from BYB’s you are just encouraging them to breed more. You are far better off to purchase from a rescue if you cannot afford to pay the higher price. Tammy he’s selling the dogs for $450.00…even if that was 2 or 3 years ago and one add say’s 5 year guarantee and one say’s 6 and the original poster said 8. Does that not raise a red flag or two? I can go onto any kijiji site or anysite like that and see a dime a dozen BYB’s selling for that price, higher or less. And if you are an excellent golden breeder or breeder of any other breed why would you sell on those sites or for that price? Ask a good breeder and they would never.

    I have to agree with Sue on this one, far to many red flags for me. If it were me looking for another golden, I’d stay clear of this guy..

  • #60467

    kobkob1
    Participant

    That is disappointing to hear about Skylon, I have not gone to visit their place so didn’t realize what kind of operation it was. I think I will start a new thread to get some more feedback. Couldn’t find a site for Ashmar Goldens??

  • #60448

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    @TwoGoldens 59906 wrote:

    I have to agree with Sue on this one, far to many red flags for me. If it were me looking for another golden, I’d stay clear of this guy..

    LOL – do not need to convince me to stay away! I personally steer people away from backyard breeders but…there is the cost factor, etc. What I really really dislike is breeding for money only and there are registered breeders that do that too.

  • #60459

    Meadow
    Participant

    @kobkob1 59907 wrote:

    That is disappointing to hear about Skylon, I have not gone to visit their place so didn’t realize what kind of operation it was. I think I will start a new thread to get some more feedback. Couldn’t find a site for Ashmar Goldens??

    That is SO weird!! I can’t find it now either! (??) I just wrote to Margaret of Ashmar, and asked her where her website link went. I’ll let you know what she says.

    ~Maureen

  • #60468

    kobkob1
    Participant

    thanks Maureen, I am looking forward to shopping around, I am in no hurry. Well when I start really thinking about it, YES I AM in a hurry, but I will rein myself in and take my time!

  • #60433

    3Goldens
    Participant

    @cheslyn1 59912 wrote:

    LOL – do not need to convince me to stay away! I personally steer people away from backyard breeders but…there is the cost factor, etc. What I really really dislike is breeding for money only and there are registered breeders that do that too.

    Very true Tammy, there are registered breeders that I would consider a ‘puppy mill’ Producing many. many litters every year. When I was doing research for Spirit I came across a web site that listed the number of litters CKC breeders were producing each year. I was shocked at some of the numbers! Wish I could find that web site now…

  • #60437

    Mom2Maddie
    Participant

    I think Aurorelle already has her puppy from this breeder she asked about. On another forum she posted asking how to stop her puppy from going to eat from her cat’s bowl after she’s done eating her food. I assumed she was still looking for advice on choosing the right breeder but it sounds like she already has the pup.

  • #60460

    Meadow
    Participant

    Oh… so it’s not opinions she’s looking for? I must have misunderstood the original post.

  • #60464

    Lynne
    Participant

    In her first post she said she was new to owning a dog and settled on this Allen Bain as a breeder and just wanted to know if anyone else knew about him. I figured she already had the dog.

    I’ve been busy so didn’t have a chance to post on this sooner but after reading the thread I hope she still comes on to this site again.

    Aurorelle – if you do read this and you have new puppy – I’d love to hear about him/her and see some pics!

  • #60434

    3Goldens
    Participant

    @meadow 59929 wrote:

    Oh… so it’s not opinions she’s looking for? I must have misunderstood the original post.

    Guess I did too!!

  • #60449

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    Me three!! And of course all the talk about golden breeders has me looking at the websites at the puppies!!!

  • #60435

    3Goldens
    Participant

    @cheslyn1 59934 wrote:

    Me three!! And of course all the talk about golden breeders has me looking at the websites at the puppies!!!

    Careful Tammy—that can be very dangerous lol

  • #60469

    kobkob1
    Participant

    Well if Aurorelle is anything like me … I fall in love with every puppy I see. Sometimes the heart takes over and the mind has no more say in it!
    When we got our first pup – a ChowChow – way back (around 1983) we picked her up from the store I had ordered her from (yes a pet store, and she was “ordered ahead of time” I really didn’t know any better back then). After getting her, I drove immediately from the store to our vets office to be checked over. When the vet checked her over he said “Yes HE is a healthy pup in good condition” You can imagine my shock when he said “HE”! I had ordered a female! So I phoned the store and drove back to the store (an hours drive) and they appologized profusely for giving me the wrong pup. But when it came right down to it, I couldn’t hand him back to them …. in that short two hours we had “bonded” so much that there was no way he was leaving my arms! I kept him and we had a terrific 16 years with him. He was an amazing dog.

  • #60450

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    @TwoGoldens 59935 wrote:

    Careful Tammy—that can be very dangerous lol

    Extremely!!! Makes Scott the hubby very nervous…which works in my favor because the dog seminar I want to go to would be cheaper LOL

  • #60472

    thomela
    Participant

    We got our golden from Al Bain over 4 years ago(as a puppy)and have the most amazing dog. If you want a CKC registerd dog then this is not where to go. If you just want a good, healthy, smart golden….a good pet….then go here. Our golden is so smart you would not believe! She has the sweetest personality, is well-behaved…I can not say enough about how good a dog she is. She is our second golden…our first we had for over 12 years and got as a puppy from the Humane Society. I would get another golden from Al Bain in a heartbeat. At first, I thought he was a big talker….and was a bit skeptical….but am overally pleased with the dog we have. As my husband was leaving with our new puppy….someone else was coming in to get a dog, too. This person told my husband that they always get their dogs from him….that he breeds the smartest and nicest dogs. So, there you go.

  • #60474

    Twilley
    Participant

    @aurorelle 59882 wrote:

    Hello everyone!

    I’m new to owning a dog so I want to make sure I’m doing it right (I have cats but their much less high maintenance). I called many breeders and I settled with one named Allen or Al Bain in Campbellford, ON. He seemed to know his stuff and claims to have over 60 years of experience. He gave me an 8 year guarantee on hip and heart problems, and claims to train support and seeing eye dogs. I couldn’t find much about him online, except for a thread on this forum from 4 years ago, so I thought I’d try asking again. Anyway, has anyone heard of Al Bain or have any experience with him?

    Thanks a lot!

    August 2012

    We have 2 Golden Retrievers from Allen Bain. Our first, Brady is 9 years old and our second, Mya is 6 years old. They are truly amazing dogs. They are beautiful, happy and very healthy. We get complimented everywhere we go on how well they behave and how beautiful they are. They are very smart and very healthy. Our vet is always telling us what good health they have (even their teeth!)
    We reccomend Allen’s dogs without question. We will never be without one of his pup’s.

    Mrs. Twilley
    Ontario, Canada

  • #60452

    Nano
    Participant

    I’m not familiar with this breeder but here are guidelines that apply to EVERY breeder of any dog. Any reputable breeder will want you to visit their kennel at least once, interview you extensively (including questions about your lifestyle, your dog history, where the dog will sleep, any activities you plan to do with the dog, etc). They will also let you meet the dam and inspect their facilities. (If both the dam and sire are owned by the breeder and on the premises that can be a red flag). They may also want to visit your home.

  • #60475

    Arklow
    Participant

    Allen is located in the Trent Hills SE of Peterborough. I am going there tomorrow to meet him.

    He certainly is not your typical breeder, and his only web presence is a Facebook Page (Al’s Goldens) that offers very little information.

    He is not a CKC breeder… his answer to that is that they don’t like him and he doesn’t like them.Claims that most Ontario Goldens are genetically weak, bred for show and all the stamina is run out of them. His low prices seem to suggest that he is either losing money on what he sells or that he is skimping on some of the certification steps. However, this is not enough to damn him outright, as many here have done. It just places him in a special niche of his own, somewhere between a well known breeder and a farm breeder.

    I will meet him to see how things are and to inspect his breeder, on site. You pays yer money and you takes yer chances, and the more you pay doesn’t necessarily guarantee anything.

  • #60453

    Nano
    Participant

    A web page that offers little info? Not a CKC breeder but has issues with them? Low prices? A reputable breeder invests tons of time, effort, and money into their program. It’s not a profit making venture. The breeder’s top priorities are maintaining the health, well being and integrity of the breed and finding the very best of homes for their puppies – for show or companon pets. But a breeder who is offering low prices as a ‘selling feature’ is not a reputable breeder in my opinion. (I don’t know if this breeder is doing that but I would certainly wouldn’t even consider a breeder who does).

    Connor’s breeder and I have kept in touch since I brought him home three years ago. She is always thrilled to hear about him, receive pictures and updates and provide any support and advice. Her website is full of info about her dogs. She doesn’t criticize other breeders or organizations. When and if the time comes to bring another Golden home, I would go straight to her. We’ve discussed the possibility and she’s given me lots to consider.

    Like some others on here, I’m picking up red flags about the breeder you’re considering. The purchase price is the smallest consideration at this point. This is commitment for the dog’s lifetime. The more research you and the breeder do about each other the better. I don’t think you can be too careful.

  • #60461

    Meadow
    Participant

    I just want to weigh in on one thing: I chose a reputable CKC breeder, and paid $1300 for Faith (price increased by $100 the night before we were to pick Faith up). I wasn’t allowed to choose my own puppy from the litter. I was given the opposite personality than that which I had specifically told the breeder was integrally important to me. The breeder was there for a year anytime I had difficulties… and then she dropped off the map. All links to her site are gone. Her email doesn’t reach her. The breeder who was the stud won’t return my emails either.

    So it’s not everyone who has a terrific experience with a CKC breeder. Just sayin’…

    ~Maureen

  • #60454

    Nano
    Participant

    Sorry to hear about all that, Maureen. I can’t believe the price was changed when you went to pick Faith up. What justification did the breeder give for THAT? Bizarre.

    I wasn’t suggesting that the CKC affiliation was any sort of guarantee. Not at all. I just don’t think the breeder should be slamming all CKC breeders. There are lots of people who have issues with the CKC and AKC but for me the issue here is this breeder’s dogs. It would make me wonder if he was hedging his bets in case the prospective owner asked around about him. I guess I have a suspicious nature. πŸ™‚

    I didn’t choose Connor either. The breeder did based on what she knew about my lifestyle and plans with my dog. She discussed all that with me beforehand, explaining why she thought this pup (who became Connor) would suit me the best.

    All I can say is, for me, the bottom line is – listen to your gut. That inner voice will tell you if something isn’t right. At least mine does and it’s never steered me wrong.

  • #60439

    Claudette Kinkade
    Participant

    @nano 62113 wrote:

    I’m not familiar with this breeder but here are guidelines that apply to EVERY breeder of any dog. Any reputable breeder will want you to visit their kennel at least once, interview you extensively (including questions about your lifestyle, your dog history, where the dog will sleep, any activities you plan to do with the dog, etc). They will also let you meet the dam and inspect their facilities. (If both the dam and sire are owned by the breeder and on the premises that can be a red flag). They may also want to visit your home.

    Why is it a RED FLAG if both the dam and sire are owned by the breeder and on the premises?

  • #60471

    I.Heart.My.Golden
    Participant

    I have to agree with at the end of the day you really have to feel comfortable with your decision – whatever it may be. I personally had a not so great experience with my very first Golden growing up. Molly came from a CKC breeder in British Columbia, I was very young at the time (about 11 years) but Molly had severe social behavioral problems with other dogs from the second we got her, where she was a perfect Golden with humans, she was extremely dominant, aggressive, explosive with other dogs. The warning signs were all there when we went to see the litter, her mother, whereas beautiful – had the exact same “attitude”. We would often return to have her groomed by the breeder, and Molly’s mother had to be completely separated away because she would be very nasty with any dogs. We also later found out that her mother killed their other toy poodle in the house…. the breeder also approached us to breed her, because she was “so beautiful” with complete disregard for their VERY non-breed standard temperament. It took me almost 8 years, and very intense training to get Molly to a place where she could be a good girl. I only saw pictures of her father, that’s it. I also like to mention I actually did enter Molly into a couple of dog shows, just for fun, because I loved the atmosphere when I was about 16 years old, the experience I had with other Golden breeders, as a young lady was very negative. They were so cruel to me, and it was so political in the show ring. I remember taking Molly over to a few “big breeders” and asked for their help in seeing if Molly was groomed properly, or if I should change anything, just for advice and to make friends really, all I got was a very cold shoulder. So as I got older, it just turned me right off the CKC.
    my experience was just sour.

    Both Otis and Wilma came from a “BYB” – but I truly hate to call them that – I wouldn’t call them that. Otis’ mother came from an extremely loving home, and his father was a friend of the family so to speak. His mother and father were in good standing with their vets, had all their vaccinations, I got to meet both parents which were just stunning. Otis’ mother was so well behaved and just fantastic, and his father was just a lovely goofball. It was a big litter, of super healthy chunky pups – and I went with my gut. I haven’t had a single issue with Otis both health wise OR behavioral – he’s just been a dream.
    And Wilma came from a similar situation – a loving family who loved their dogs, and bred them. There was no in it to “make money”, or anything shady. The pups lived in a fantastic environment, clean, well socialized – it just felt right. I also met both of her mom and dad and they were just amazing, healthy dogs – they were so happy and came perfectly from a family with love. The breeder told me that she was in great standing with her vet, and it was a very organized and thought-out process (breeding her dogs) and went with everything her vet recommended, she even had them xrayed to be sure. She even waited until Wilma’s mom was 3 years to be sure she was the right age, and had the time and finances to do it properly. I’ve yet to have a single problem with Wilma both Health and behavioral. So both of my current dogs I am VERY happy I saw both parents, and wanted to.

    So when people ask me if CKC means everything? Championships?Titles? I’m not sure. I’ve heard and experienced MANY good/bad things. People tell me I’m taking a massive chance because the parents don’t have full clearances, etc etc and I completely understand that, and did at the time of getting both my dogs, but at the end of the day I am very happy with my decisions. SO happy. I do not look down on anybody who wants to make an educated decision about what their doing, there’s absolutely nothing wrong in that. But I think when it comes to getting the dog, people are very quick to judge – we can be pretty brutal to each other. I think there is so much grey-area around breeding, and whats more important than other things. But this is only my experience and I can only stick to what I know. Sorry about the long post, but I felt like I should put my two cents worth in.

  • #60438

    Marianne
    Participant

    O.K. for my two bits. Puppies can be obtained from a variety of sources and not all of them are model breeders even some on the CKC membership list. And lets face it millions of puppies are brought from someone in the neighbourhood nor someone you know. I think though that if you are comfortable with the people, their operation and their dogs then there is nothing wrong at all in buying a puppy from a BYB. There is a problem however if the breeder does not willingly give information about themselves and their dogs. Just how I feel.

  • #60442

    Sue
    Participant

    Seriously??? These are golden retrievers, one of the dog breeds that has some of of most health issues out there….buy from a reputable breeder that does all clearances on their dogs. Buy from one that does more than just breeds 2 dogs. Buy from a reputable breeder who is trying to advance the betterment of the breed. If not then go to the pound and adopt from there or rescue.

  • #60455

    Nano
    Participant

    I agree with Sue. If you can’t find a breeder who provides full disclosure and provides all the necessary clearances on whichever breed you choose, then rethink your options.

    The reason that having the dam and sire both on site can be a red flag is that it can indicate inbreeding. Or at the very least, breeding two dogs just because they live in the same house without consideration of inherited health issues. Reputable breeders research their breeding lines very carefully and go outside to bring in other healthy bloodlines.

  • #60451

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    Nancy is right…most breeders (I know of some that have hired help that can but they are the exemption) can not afford to buy and keep enough dogs to do breeding correctly. It is doable to have multiple intact males in the same house but not the easiest to do either. That is why co-owning happens a lot.

    You have to remember breeders might rehome their retired breeding males or females but 98% do not as they are attached at the heart πŸ™‚ So that increase the # of dogs. LOL trust me I bug them for the retirees…I always have a wait list for adopting.

    My concern with BYB is if they have the experience in determining if the puppy is going to the right home. If not, some of them end up in rescue πŸ™ Everyone definitely has a preference–I had the opposite awful experience with a mixed rescue.

  • #60476

    Arklow
    Participant

    I went to Allen Bain’s farm to see his set up and to look at his dogs. They occupy a large part of the ground floor of Mr. Bain’s living quarters. It seemed like a very happy co-existence. We spent an hour there, in close contact with the dogs and listening to Al.

    Mr. Bain was able to demonstrate a deep knowledge of his animals and explained in detail how he breeds and cares for his dogs. They are smaller than the norm, but muscular, with good coats. They are known for their intelligence and personalities and I can attest that of the four sires and dams we saw all were very happy and well socialized.

    He railed against the practices of the CKC breeders who line breed, calling it incest. He claimed that he has never had a genetically diseased dog in all his years of work.

    I asked him who his Vet was… Dr. Pavel in Tweed. I phoned them and got nothing but the highest recommendations for both Bain and his dogs…. always get their shots and deworming done on time, and all of them are known for their personalities and health. Bain has been using Dr. Pavel for three years.

    We put a deposit on the next litter.

  • #60473

    thomela
    Participant

    Enjoy your puppy, Arklow. Like I said in an earlier post….we Love Love Love our Golden Retriever Keeta:-) She is the sweetest, smartest dog ever. Knock on wood…she is almost 7 years old and we have never had a problem with her. She is a big SUCK. We chose Al Bain because he had smaller goldens(American Golden Retriever) and we wanted one that was a golden red colour. We get compliments about her all the time….about her temperment, looks, smartness. My husband met Keetas parents before we decided to purchase a dog from Al Bain….and Al was totally willing to spend the time talking to him. We thought it was too good to be true the way Al was bragging about his dogs…but he was right! I would love another dog from him anyday.

  • #60477

    Lola
    Participant

    Hello,
    We have one of his dogs. He is a healthy male, wonderful temperament, very smart. We had him going consistently to the door to use the potty after 4 days. Our Vet states he is in perfect health. He is also very handsome! We chose Allen because he is not CKC registered as we have had two registered dogs in the past and one died at age 5 from an aneurism and the other from splenic cancer weeks after his tenth birthday. Both were from different breeders. So personally for us having a registered dog meant nothing. I’m not trying to suggest that our choice is the correct choice for others, simply that it was our choice to purposely look for an unregistered golden.

    Allen is a bit of a character on the phone. He lives on an active farm and does not use email or the internet. Hi wife will use email to tell you to phone them. He is quite knowledgable about the breed and their needs. I have called a few times since we brought our boy home and he has been helpful and considerate and he genuinely cares about his dogs. He did give us an 8 year guarantee which I know some will laugh at but at lest he stands behind his dogs. I would go back to Allen again for another one in a few years. Good Luck.

  • #60478

    Darren
    Participant

    @aurorelle 59882 wrote:

    Hello everyone!

    I’m new to owning a dog so I want to make sure I’m doing it right (I have cats but their much less high maintenance). I called many breeders and I settled with one named Allen or Al Bain in Campbellford, ON. He seemed to know his stuff and claims to have over 60 years of experience. He gave me an 8 year guarantee on hip and heart problems, and claims to train support and seeing eye dogs. I couldn’t find much about him online, except for a thread on this forum from 4 years ago, so I thought I’d try asking again. Anyway, has anyone heard of Al Bain or have any experience with him?

    Thanks a lot!

    Hi Aurorelle
    I am new to this site, so not up on how to respond or attach pictures, but you were asking about Al Bain. I bought a Golden from him coming up on 6 yrs. now, Max has been the best dog I have ever owned, smartest, most caring and completely trusted. He has never had any medical issues, except once he got a tick and I went through the tests with him for Lyme, but other than that nothing. His belly is sensitive to food, so adding thing or change of diet really throws his stomach, but I heard that is common with this breed. Al is a different individual, but he does truly care about his dogs and what he said to me about their habits and nature was spot on. I know it’s been awhile since you posted, hope this helps. I will go back to Al if I don’t breed Max myself

  • #65776

    gpbarr1
    Participant

    You been scammed dear!

  • #65961

    christine
    Participant

    Please people do not get a dog from Al Bain his dogs are not normal we had to put ours down at the age of 2 for attacking. Our vet said he could be inbred. You pay for what you get our dog wasn’t the only one I know a few.

  • #67731

    Mom2Maddie
    Participant

    People that post about their dogs from this breeder only ever seem to post once. Would love to see pics of your new pup once you get it.

  • #67732

    cheslyn1
    Participant

    And the posts for this breeder start up on other sites as well LOL.

    If anyone has problems with their golden and want some friendly advice or has adorable photos to share I hope they return — myself I am not commenting on this breeder. Do not know him or his dogs.

  • #67734

    Sue
    Participant

    Not this again…yah…yah…yah…

  • #67955

    Chris
    Participant

    Hi,
    I wanted to share our experience with Al. This family genuinely loves their dogs and does not interbreed (and owning him for 8 years now, i would put money on the guarantee of a healthy dog). I know 8 years ago (wow, it was actually in July), there was a waiting list for ours, and they were more then welcome to show us their puppies and the adults. All in all, it was fantastic. We got our pup 8 years ago, and he is still going strong. We took the time with him when he was a puppy (crate training, exercise, dog parks, etc) , and have never had any bad experiences with him. He is the smartest animal we have ever owned, and is loved by everyone who comes in contact with him. If we ever were going to get another one, we would be going back, but not sure if this special guy could ever be replaced.

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  • #68567

    C.Simmonds
    Participant

    I have a precious gift from Allan Bain. He is the smartest, well mannered, balanced dog we have ever had. I would go to Allen again in the future. I don’t know who was interviewing who when we went to see the puppies. He spoke to us at length to make sure we were suitable owners and we found him to be the breeder we would use. It is four years and am thinking of adding to the family. I was looking for his address.

  • #68901

    sarah
    Participant

    TO: ALL THE PEOPLE WHO BUY DOGS FROM AL BAIN,

    I worked for Al Bain at his farm, and this man is a fraud. The puppies that are born sometimes are deformed, many litters of puppies are dead due to not paying any attention to the pregnant mothers when giving birth. When other customers go on vacation and drop off their dogs last year, that customer’s poor dog was left in a cage in the barn unattended, only given attention when feeding them. And he charge this customer $300 bucks…lol. You don’t have to believe me, but I did work at his farm!

  • #69101

    Lisa
    Participant

    I would suggest you all stay as far away from Allan Bain as you can!!
    And those who have dogs from don’t ever take them back.
    I answered an ad on kijiji from Al Bain for board in exchange for farm chores.
    When I got there I found over 35 dogs in filthy cages and yes the SPCA was there while I was there and he hid over 15 of the dogs.
    They are kept in cages 24/7 outside. When I went to change the water when I got there it was green from algae and mold was growing on the poop.
    There is one kept in a room upstairs in the house and lives in its own filth and holes that the dogs get hurt on in their cages.
    I have a horse and brought my horse there when I went and when I left to come back to Pickering to get the rest of my things to go back up there as I thought I could make a difference he got very nasty and gave my horse away apparently?
    I don’t know at this time where my horse is or if he is safe but this is not a man you want to support by getting a dog from him.
    He never had any contact with the outside dogs, he doesn’t even know their names.
    He is very cruel to the animals he is in contact with.
    Except Rice who he tells most people he is the father as he is very intelligent and Al does treat him nicely, from what I saw.
    He does not know who is breeding who.
    When he notices a dog in heat they are then put in a cage together and left for indefinitely.
    This is only what I saw and my opinions.
    If you are going to get a dog from him please ask to see all the dogs and papers!!

    • #69255

      Anonymous

      This breaks my heart! I’m very sorry to hear about your horse πŸ™

  • #69102

    Sue
    Participant

    Seriously not this again…Can we close this topic once and for all.

    • This reply was modified 1 year, 11 months ago by  Sue.
  • #69104

    Sue
    Participant

    Red flags everywhere…

  • #69238

    Jakes
    Participant

    We got a Golden Retriever female from Al Bain.When we picked her up there were none of the conditions described previously in this forum. Al obviously cares a lot about his dogs, he has loads of experience and there was no sign of neglect. Our female are the most wonderful , healthy dog we ever owned. She has no health issues and we get compliments from lots of other people for what an amazing dog she is.
    She had puppies while with us and her pups were amazingly healthy and none of them has any health issues- even the vet commended about the great health of her pups.
    We have been in contact with Al on the phone asking advice for a friend who has an issue with a dog from another kind of breed and he was great and helpful , he knows soooo much about breeding and dog health.
    We can recommend Al as a breeder and if we want to buy another retriever we would buy it from Al again.
    I suspect that some of the negative comments on this site has been made by breeders who are jealous of Al and his great dogs.

  • #69249

    Sue
    Participant

    I adopted a 6 month old male golden retriever pup in Aug 2015 from someone who purchased the pup from Al Bain in Feb 2015. As I was curious about where he came from my research brought me to this forum. Needless to say there are some good and some bad experiences reported here as well as advocates for CKC breeders verses backyard breeders. I have had my pup now for 4 months and he is a beautiful, smart and loving dog.
    While certainly some health conditions are hereditary, there are other factors that contribute to an over all healthy dog. Things like good food, regular exercise and respectful loving treatment.
    I think all purchasers of any dog need to do their research prior to purchasing. There will most certainly be more and more backyard breeders as Golden Retrievers are becoming unaffordable for most people through CKC breeders.

    • #69256

      C.Simmonds
      Participant

      Hi,

      Good Blog. My male is 5 years old now and is perfect. He is in great health, smart and has a great demeanor.
      When we went to see Allen, I don’t know who was interviewing who. He wanted a lot of information about our old dog.He asked for pictures & vet information. We wanted the same from him. We were there for hours.
      If I every get another one I will definitely be seeing Allen.

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  • #69254

    Anonymous

    I am an animal and dog lover!
    I have followed this blog for awhile
    Sarah-please contact me as I would like more info about which dates you were at the farm please
    Lisa-please contact me as I have heard about your horse story. I am very sorry you had a bad experience πŸ™ I would love to talk to you please
    Sue from August 31 post-please don’t judge people it’s unfair. This is the only public forum about Allen Bain, and people deserve to know the truth
    I have nothing to gain by posting, just embarrassment.

  • #69322

    Jon
    Participant

    We have a golden from Allan Bain. I haven’t seen anything recently posted about him, but I found it to be a little surreal when we purchased, very ecentric guy, kinda of a hoarder, with dogs everywhere and an overgrown farm, broken down trailers etc. Our Retriever was aggressive at first, took a bit of training, amazing dog five years later, very intelligent. In future I think I would go with a more “normal” breeder, if there is such a thing. I seem to recall our last two breeders we dealt with were kooky too. Maybe it goes with the territory?

  • #69324

    Jayendra
    Participant

    I got my 4 years old ‘Red’ golden retriever frim Allen. We call him ‘Tofu’. He is one of the most good looking, healthy and physically strong golden retrievers we see in our neighborhood. Even after being four years old Tofu gets stopped by people who want to meet him and pat him fof how beautiful he is. We are 100% confident that we made a great choice in buying Tofu from Allen Bain/Mary. He gave us 8 years guarantee for any hip issues, and Tofu can run super fast without any hip/joints trouble. Allen does know a lot about the breed and the reason he does not belong to any popular kennel club is because he does not want to mix his dogs’ bloodline with any kennel blood line. I would certainly recommend Allen before any kennel club around. I live in Toronto and if anyone would like to meet Tofu or see his pictures please do not hesitate to write to me at jayendrajd@gmail.com

    Jay.

  • #69328

    Jen
    Participant

    My husband and I just visited Allen Bain’s farm today to check out his dogs, and we have MAJOR concerns. Our gut said that something is very wrong with the whole picture. However, I do find it interesting that the only two people (Sarah and Lisa in this forum) who have expressed significant concerns with how he breeds and raises his dogs formerly worked with him on the farm. Did no one else who went to visit the farm or pick up the puppies have any issues with how this place was run?

    When we pulled up to the farm, we could hear a number of dogs barking from somewhere behind or in the barn, however we could no see them. Al welcomed us into his kitchen and sat down with us for well over an hour to talk. He left for a few minutes to grab his sire (Rice) who was out with one of the females who was in heat. When he left, I noticed a dog in the living room next door in a cage in the middle of the floor. It never made a sound. Very odd, I thought. Both my husband and I felt that this was not normal. We asked Al about that dog and he said this was a new 6 month old male that he picked up from the States. He said he had forgotten that he had left him in the living room. The whole house smelled of urine, and I wondered how long that poor dog had been left in that cage.

    Rice came into the kitchen and he was the only dog that we were able to interact with. He is a beautiful dog and well trained. Al showed us a ‘trick’ where he placed a full hot dog in the dog’s mouth at made him sit there for what seemed like far too long holding it in his mouth without eating it. Then the dog was given permission to eat the hot dog on command. Yes, the dog was well trained but we almost felt as though it was more afraid than anything else. Again we were so uncomfortable with how long he ‘tested’ the dog with food.

    I understand that he has many years of experience. However I found it very odd and concerning that he would not show us any of the female dogs. Most legitimate breeders are more than thrilled to show you parents, grandparents and offspring on site. It felt as though he was hiding something. He told us that he has over 20 female dogs. They are all kept in cages to be let out to the back pond for only 30 minutes a day. He seems to be breeding multiple females at a time, and was unable to tell us who the next mother would be. It was certainly not the type of experience we have had with other breeders whose dogs have names and are a part of a loving home. The females are only allowed in the house when they have puppies and they do no seem to have names.

    We asked for references and are still waiting to hear back from Mary (who we never got to meet) with contact numbers. Despite spending a lot of time talking with Al, we are left with so many unanswered questions. He spent more time talking about his theories on life and his distaste for other breeders and (most) veterinarians, and really could not give us a clear picture of what life is like for his dogs and how he raises these puppies. He did mention that no one is allowed to touch his puppies until they are vaccinated and ready to leave (as he is worried about canine parvovirus being brought in from other dogs). This is somewhat understandable. However, he also said that no one touches his females either, which I think is worrisome from a socialization and temperament standpoint.

    I think I have said enough for now. I certainly felt uneasy after leaving that place. It was a very bizarre and overall concerning experience. We will certainly be looking for a puppy at a registered kennel. We want to know that the dog has come from a reputable place where it is well loved and taken care of before coming into our home. We also want to know that the parents (both male and female) are cared for in the same way, and unfortunately I cannot verify that this is the case with this particular breeder.

  • #69330

    Lisa
    Participant

    Whoever wanted to contact me regarding Al Bain can call 226-234-4560
    I am enclosing a pic of my champion TB that Al kept from me
    It was a fight to get him back which took me almost a month

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  • #69332

    Lisa
    Participant

    This is him now

  • #69334

    Eugene
    Participant

    I have found this forum because my beloved little dog, Buffy, that I purchased from Allen passed away at 11.5 years of age. I do not for a single second regret buying my little girl from him all those years ago. She never had any health complications until now, giving in to cancer. But her age fell within the higher bracket of the golden retriever age range.
    If I were to get another dog, I would most likely go to Allen, because it was him who gave me the greatest gift of my life whom I miss incredibly.
    I am also so thankful to Allen for the low price tag he puts on his dogs — I got Buffy when I was a poor high school student with my first summer job salary at $400. I would never be able to afford a higher price at that point.
    Thank you Allen.

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  • #69337

    Lisa
    Participant

    This is to the guy who said he didn’t see any of the conditions described!! Are you blind? Those who are fooled by him and see him as a knowledgeable breeder who wants everyone to have a golden ARE dead wrong!!
    Did you not see the dilapidated barn and the green algae growing in the dogs water bowls?
    Allen Bain is a disgusting human being and should have no animals!!
    Those of you who didn’t meet Mary it’s because Allan gives her enough gas to get to where she has to go to make money!!
    She is a wonderful woman who Allan had turned into a zombie by feeding her pills
    He also had/has a 22 year old French girl there who I helped escape from him last year!!
    He was having sex with her and feeding her pills
    She would work day and night taking care of things so he didn’t bother her
    There was also no door on her room
    There is a stallion in that barn who has been inside for years
    He almost killed my horse
    This piece of crap should not have animals or be sharing our air
    Did anyone here his taxidermy stories or that he was a sergeant at arms for a biker club?
    He also has horses that are on their own all year round and 2 pigs In the same stall as the stallion
    There r chickens and roosters all torn apart from fighting and he is very cruel to the dogs
    The females are NEVER let out of the cages!! When they go in heat he throws a male in and there they remain till the puppies are born OUTSIDE
    in the two weeks I was prisoner there the SPCA came and told him he had to take one of the females to a vet to fix her leg so he killed her
    You all are supporting this by buying dogs from him and should be ashamed!!

  • #69359

    Ethster Ramsey
    Participant

    Actually I too once respond to a posting to help out at Allen’s farm.
    I heared about working with puppies and horses and thought ‘awe”
    But what I experienced was hell on earth for any animal lover.
    I did call the SPCA, however All does not let them on his property. apparently a long legal process has to take place (considering the circumstances) to put a stop to such cruel breeding. Even to get a warrant for animal cruelty cases feels like forever sadly. please if you adopted a dog from him, and can’t keep them , do spread the word to take them to the humane society, and not back there! The more who spread awareness, the more chances of helping these poor innocent creature’s. The cages are filthy and the dogs are always starving. The saddest part is the ones taken back or not sold fast as puppies, are simply disregard with no human contact.The hole time I was there no dog was ever walked, ever! Not once.The animals back away at attempted contact because he is so cruel. He gets away with starving them by spending several days at a time not feeding them, and than dumping loads of food in there cage, as this causes them to binge eat and look fed when there still suffering. The reason that dog rice will sit forever with that hotdog in his mouth drooling until All says it’s okay, (which he is so proud of) is because what a surprise! That dog is abused. I thought his friend was absolutely insane for telling me that dogs are barried all around his property,anf it was a joke. I thought, yea right no one actually does that, even with dogs no one wants! That is until All and Marry went to eat there usual Chinese, and I went to the places he forbid me to go. I will never forget what I saw, and was sick to my stomach after seeing. After leaving the farm and reporting it, I will never forget that day. My family were all like “I am so sorry, you had to see that”
    Even though the truth can haunt some of us, I actually feel better I looked . This has been a life changing experience that has made me want to devote spare time to volunteer, and activate for animals in the future. It is better than not knowing, and supporting these types of breeders. ( Yes over the years I learned there has been some growing concerns about that place, and yes All does bribe people to say good things online) this may explain past cheesy over defensive previous random remarks. In conclusion atleast I am more concerned about helping animals now, as weird as that may sound. As Good old Dr. phill puts “you can not change what you don’t acknowledge” but once you do your life changes for the good.

  • #69383

    Alexandria
    Participant

    Hello everyone,I have noticed their aren’t many new posts on this thread so I wanted to post.

    I am new to the golden world. I found an ad for Al Bain on Kijiji and thought I would give him a call. I have talked to him 3 times on the phone and never had any weird feelings about him, yes he is an odd ball but not in a bad way. He is very knollageble about golden retrievers and told me even if I decided to go with someone else to not loose his number as he would answer any questions I had about training or the breed in general. After talking with him my fiancΓ© and I had decided to go see his dogs and put down a deposite (he said we could mail in a cheque but he would rather us come in as he is very proud of his dogs).

    Now after finding this thread I’m having a hard time I don’t know who to believe all the people saying they have amazing pups from Al or the few horror stories.

    We are going to visit him this Saturday so I will post an update.

    • #69394

      christine
      Participant

      I Hope you didn’t get one of his dogs. This man needs to STOP breeding

  • #69386

    Ethster Ramsey
    Participant

    Hi Alexandra, I think it would be a good idea if you could contact me at jesuisjax11@gmail.com I have nothing to lose or gain, just information I would want if I were to adopt a dog. Also Sarah if you read this, I would really appreciate it.

  • #69389

    Lisa
    Participant

    It is very sad to see he is still been allowed to carry on and abuse these animals
    All you people praising him are also part of the problem
    It’s a shame you can’t cure stupid
    If the condition of his farm, home, slave(Mary),barn and animals weren’t enough to send red flags than go get help though I suspect a lot of these posts were made by Mary at Al’s direction
    I feel bad for those who have to love with knowing they have facilitated this abuse!
    If anyone wants to know the truth don’t hestitate to contact me
    I can tell you right now I am a race horse owner and WILL NOT deal with peta but I will talk to anyone other than them! I have nothing to hide and nothing to gain but those animals have everyone to gain!!

    • #69396

      christine
      Participant

      You are right Lisa. He is now selling his dogs for 750 and he says hes a registered breeder

  • #69400

    E.Ramsey
    Participant

    This is one of the poor souls,who didn’t make it past the winter
    On Allen Bains dogs who didnot make it through the winter

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  • #69402

    E.Ramsey
    Participant

    Some poor creatures, who didn’t get make
    It past the winter on Allen Bains farm

  • #67725

    Jenna
    Participant

    I have put a deposit on one of Al’s pups and am so excited! I realize there is a lot of speculation on Allen Bain as a breeder; I became quite nervous after reading a lot of reviews on him. However, the people who are commenting on him negatively are the people who do not know Allen personally, and have never interacted with him (for the most part). There are a couple of posts from people stating that they had to put their dogs from Allen down due to aggression; but I am not going to blame Allen for this, as I do not know the inside story of how these dogs were trained or treated by their new owners. (Not to say they were mis-trained or mistreated; I’m simply stating I do not judge when I don’t know proper details).

    Any negative comment I have read regarding Al, is all completely the opposite from what he told me. Ok, ok; tell me I am a sucker and have been scammed. I will let you know that personally after I have one of his pups and can decide that for myself. I WILL be back here to update.

    Allen is not a member with the CKC because he chooses not to be. Does this make him better or worse than those who are? No. People have their own beliefs, and who the heck are we to judge whether his beleifs are right or wrong? Purchasing a dog from a breeder who is a part of the CKC; with clearances and papers, etc. can virtually mean nothing. As many of these posts prove, a lot of people purchase registered dogs from registered breeders with all of the paperwork and STILL have problems. Regardless of your choices, we are all taking a risk.

    I should have my pup from Al within the next few months. My instincts originally told me he’s the one; he’s knowledgable, has a great guarantee, he welcomes us to contact him or see him anytime with training tips or questions, and is super affordable. His reasoning to that is his dogs are amazing with children and he thinks every family should have a fair chance to have a great family dog; not everyone has thousands of dollars to fork over. He DOES in fact prefer his clients to meet the parents of the pups first to get to know their temperament, etc. I’ll be back to confirm how I feel about Allen as a breeder; but I feels it’s odd that everyone is so quick to judge because he does not support promoting dogs for show.

  • #69395

    christine
    Participant

    Well Jenna he told me to bring my dog back so he could beat it with a baseball bat and he will never bit again.

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